Talk:Shadowmane/sandbox

New Layout Review
Giving this a review like you asked, Alex... got a couple insights that might help to streamline the page structure, layout and whatnot. I see the wiki has a new template box that provides an overview of attacks for various different creatures, and the base damage of these varied attacks (when they can be computed and added). These boxes I believe are your doing and are being spread across the wiki to replace the old base damage and attack data layout? I like it, but these could use some tweaking.

As you know, in the utility section of a good number of pages are control instructions that help you to familiarize yourself with how to use a tame's abilities. Some of these abilities aren't attacks, so they wouldn't fit in the 'attacks' heading that you've put the box under. But with other controls being moved to the new 'attacks' template boxes, it's splitting up the control directions into a divided mess of sorts. You can see this on the new Shadowmane page you've got in the works here in the sandbox. I see the note about the charge jump has stayed in utility while the other abilities have been moved to the new template.

To help, i'd suggest renaming the 'Attacks' heading for the new template into 'Abilities' instead, and just like with the attacks, provide both the control scheme and the stamina cost for these abilities. That way, both the controls, attacks, their stamina costs (and base damage when applicable) can all be neatly wrapped up into one tidy package, short and sweet.

Finally, it'd be a good idea to add a disclaimer to the abilities sections that 'The absolute base damage is shown here instead of the percentage', to let players know that damage percentage and the levels pumped into it is a modifier that affects the base damage of the attacks in the ability section.

Otherwise, this is pretty dang good... I love the new layout and the template box we're using, helps to make the pages look more interesting and provides more variety to the layout. Easier on the eyes you know? A lot more attention-grabbing than walls of text. The layout is also well-done, as the new template location streamlines perfectly as a follow up directly beneath the other templates with data values. Secondly, the Combat section following this new template opens up some VERY convenient continuation opportunities, because you can just point to the above mentioned information from the 'abilities/attacks' list, without having to explain the functions in three different sections (utility, combat, and the old base damage template layout). In example: with the 'attacks/abilities' template giving a short and accurate summary of the tame's abilities and controls, it helps to keep other sections less bloated... I don't need to repeat detailed effects a second time in another section to make sure players know what to expect when 'creature 1 does ability 2, etc'.

as a side note, aside from adding the charge jump ability to the attacks template and better renaming it to function both as an attack layout AND an other abilities/control template... I have some suggestions about altering the Combat section for creatures across the wiki.

The current layout for the Combat section for most pages is, in this order: General, Strategy, Weaponry, Dangers, & Weakness. To better streamline the information, I think changing the order to this would be more effective: General, Dangers, Weaknesses, Strategy, & Weaponry. Why? Well General is good where it's at as it's an initial and brief overview, but following this is where the old order goes off the rails a bit... You need to know the dangers you'll be facing and the weaknesses of your opponent BEFORE you can talk strategy. Coming up with a strategy before you know those former two overviews can lead to errors. With strategy in place, then would be the time to talk about the weaponry you can use AFTER you've come up with a strategy. Get what I'm saying? Strategy would say 'you can lure the Amargasaurus off a cliff from a distance!', where weaponry would follow up with saying 'you can shoot the amargasaurus with a longneck rifle from a distance to lure it off a cliff!'.

That's about all the input i've got for now on the Shadowmane page's updates and general wiki layout to follow. Though I DO have one more question for ya... Will you be getting the color template box in order for the Amargasaurus and Sinomacrops pages soon? I play on console and I don't have access to the Devkit to look into color regions and their full range of values, likewise i've tried to help set up the color regions templates for those pages, but the wikia just seems to reject my attempts xD heh... sorry about that. Anyway, I've got some of the new Lost Island tames and I'm very eager to personally color them with console commands. VERY appreciated that you got the Dinopithecus up so far, though.

Saltyralty (talk) 10:42, 21 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Colour regions for LI creatures are coming soon, I'll be writing a script to add that data later today. Alexrmski (talk) 12:08, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Combat section layout proposition sounds completely valid to me, but it might be better to get others' input in the Discord. Alexrmski (talk) 12:09, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

Layout Addenum:
Side note... for tames that have carry functions like the Mammoth or grapple/pin functions like the Thylacoleo, it might be a good idea to move the 'carry/other function' layout to the new abilities/controls/attacks template section you've got going, JUST beneath the new template... so when players see in the abilities template that the tame has a carry ability, they can immediately follow up on the information one WHAT other tames that ability can be used on.

Saltyralty (talk) 10:46, 21 December 2021 (UTC)


 * I believe we've done that for one of creatures like that already ;) Alexrmski (talk) 12:08, 21 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Oh? Which one, I'd like a look at it. Saltyralty (talk) 12:23, 21 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Wyvern. Alexrmski (talk) 12:33, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

Attacks Addendum:
Another thing I noticed in the new Attacks template that has replaced the old layout we had on old pages is that you have the 'bite' ability listed, and mapped to the 'right click, RT, R2' button... Something that should be noted is that the shadowmane actually does FIVE different attacks with that button, depending on whether you're staying still or moving. The Shadowmane will bite, perform a right or left claw side-swipe, or a right or left claw down-swipe. All five of five of these attacks (technically three) have a different base damage and modifier. The bite attack deals less damage than the claw swipes, while the side-swipes deal different damage than the down-swipes. I think i'll add this in myself for ya (so you don't have to do all the work, and again, thank you for all the work you do on the wiki xD). The important thing to note here is to make SURE you list all the attacks that are mapped to that button, as some attacks are mapped ot the same button and have a different base damage than the others mapped to said button.

Saltyralty (talk) 11:01, 21 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Thanks.

Regarding your edit notes: I added a "charge primary" and "charge jump" preset to the template in the keybindings/controls parameter. Could you check out the source editor by the way, in case it'll make it a little easier for you? Visual Editor's known to mess up a lot of the syntax, and doesn't really make interactions with templates any easier. Pick "Edit source" from the dropdown right next to the top edit button. Alexrmski (talk) 12:08, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

I occasionally go for Source Editor when visual is messing with me, so I'm somewhat familiar with it, though i prefer visual. Thanks for the addon to the control scheme in the template, that should prove useful to a LOT of different pages. That said, I THINK i'm getting the hang of the new template in visual. Aside from the trouble with the "Hold" note, I managed to add the charge jump section in working order as you saw. Saltyralty (talk) 12:27, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

Logging for the night
HAHAAAAA! Hot-DANG this page is looking slick! Now THAT'S teamwork. Was happy to pitch in and contribute to the new layout formation; looking more streamlined and reader-friendly than ever. For now though, i've stayed up WAY longer than I should xD. Gonna call it a night, get some sleep, and might get back to you later if anything else comes to mind. Was great working with you on this for the evening Alex, hope to see this new layout spread out through the wiki a bit. For now, see you around, and shoot me a PM on my talk page if you need me. Saltyralty (talk) 12:35, 21 December 2021 (UTC)